George:

I beg to differ.  I think "raptor" is a word of many meanings,
including your definition.  When speaking of birds, a raptor is a
bird of prey, so owls are often included, being nocturnal birds
of prey (families strigidae and tytonidae).  Even though vultures
are probably not in the falconiformes order anymore, they may
still be deserving of the term raptor.  They may not capture much
live prey, like hawks and eagles, but they eat nestlings
regularly in the breeding season.  (Of course, so do the crow
family.  Are shrikes raptors?)

If you ask an aware kid what a raptor is, he will likely say,
correctly, "T. rex".  (Of course, you know that is not a rapper,
like Ice T.)  Paleontologists use the term raptor for the
hunter-carnivore dinosaurs.

My understanding of the enlightened taxonomist's view of New
World vultures is that they are "incertae sedis" (Latin for "of
uncertain placement").  There are recent conflicting data for
their membership in the storks (ciconiiformes) and in hawks and
eagles (order falconiformes), and it is not yet resolved.  (AOU
took a stand, but I think they are premature.  Check out Don
Roberson's commentary, footnote #9, at
http://montereybay.com/creagrus/list.html)

I think you meant to say that vultures used to be placed before
waterfowl - but waterfowl have been moved (with gallinaceous
birds) in front of all North American birds.  AOU puts vultures
between storks and hawks/ eagles (44th supplement, and I think in
45th, too).

Bill Ellis
avian taxonomy putz
Eldersburg
Carroll Co.


-----Original Message-----
From: Maryland Birds & Birding
[mailto:[log in to unmask]]On
Behalf Of George M. Jett
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2004 8:24 PM
To: 
Subject: Re: [MDOSPREY] Eastern Neck Hawk Watch - Saturday
October 23


Folks

Vultures are not raptors.  They are more closely related to
storks, but
Walter Ellison can explain this in more detail then I.  They
often get
included in raptor counts.  Raptors are in the order falconidae
and
accipitridae.  Vultures are cathartidae, and they are now placed
before
waterfowl (ducks and geese).  Maybe it is tradition.

George